Cyberstones-A Lutheran Blog

Is bread ever "just" bread?

• Mar 01, 2010 08:54:02 Re: Is bread ever "just" bread?-(Click here to respond to this comment.) - daniel skillman
  Is bread ever "just" bread? In inter-Lutheran dialogues, I think it is enough to answer this with a simple, "no." One should not even need to argue the point.
  
  The crucifixion/resurrection of Jesus is the center of the scriptures, the beating heart of every word of God. The sacrament of holy communion presents the crucified/risen Jesus to us in bread and wine. The whole Gospel of Matthew is leading up to the institution of the Lord's Supper and the event that it re-presents. Every line of the Gospel points to this, forshadows this, anticipates this, prepares for this, preaches this, explicates this, and calls us to participate in this. What line of scripture does not preach Christ? None. Who is Christ but the one crucified and raised for us? What line of scripture does not speak of the crucified/resurrected one?
  
  Here is a maxim that I think should be a basic a priori principle among Lutherans (One might have to argue this point from other angels among different denominations, but within Lutheranism, we should regard this as established.): If you can find Christ crucifed and raised in a passage, you can/should/must find the sacraments.
  
  Or how about this one: To talk about Christ is to talk about the sacraments, and vice versa.
  
  We should be able to find holy communion in the geneology. For a Lutheran not to be able to find the Eucharist in passages that explicitly mention "bread" or "wine" or "grapes" or "vineyards" is completely beyond me.
  
  In Christ,
  Daniel

Pentitential Pslams and the Litany

• Feb 27, 2010 01:24:19 After reading you site, Your site is very useful for me .I bookm-(Click here to respond to this comment.) - account money
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• Feb 24, 2010 15:24:27 Re: Pentitential Pslams and the Litany - K
  I know that observing a fast prior to the Lord's Supper is not observed very often in the LCMS. However, it is puzzling to me that most congregations seem to discourage fasting during Lent and Advent by offering a meal before the Divine Service. Folks who do fast on such occasion either exclude themselves from these meals, or go and are subjected to endless questioning over why they aren't eating... thus defeating an essential part of the practice of fasting.

Spare us, O Lord

• Feb 24, 2010 21:38:59 Re: Spare us, O Lord - Jeff
  Wow. What an incredible sermon.

Apology to Rev. Otten

• Feb 05, 2010 20:43:58 Re: Apology to Rev. Otten - Brandon
  Smooth.
• Jan 31, 2010 16:27:12 Re: Apology to Rev. Otten - helen
  "I'm sorry I said it, but I still believe it so I'll say it again."
  What kind of apology is that?
  Accusing a Lutheran Pastor of working for the devil (or Sauron) isn't going to hurt? [What provoked that!?]
  
  Your father confessor has my sympathy if he tries to sort this one out!
  [And I don't even read Otten.]
  • Feb 05, 2010 20:46:08 Re: Apology to Rev. Otten - Jay F.
    Agreed.
    
    What seems misguided is the way you "apologized." It seems you need to repent for your "apology" as well.
  • Feb 01, 2010 03:18:32 Re: Apology to Rev. Otten - S. Brown
    Dear schizophrenic helen,
    
    "What kind of apology is that?" An honest one, I would say. And his Father confessor doesn't need your sympathy. No one does. Finally, thanks for explaining the humor of Otten/Cascione for us. What ever happened to women learning in silence? Did you come across that verse yet while studying your Bible?
    • Feb 02, 2010 13:00:03 Re: Apology to Rev. Otten - Jeff
      S. Brown- you're a jerk. People like you are why my neighbors don't go to church.
      
      That is all.
    • Feb 02, 2010 00:43:13 Re: Apology to Rev. Otten - S. Ostapowich
      S. Brown, I think you owe helen an apology. I assume your response was also made in anger and that you are not actually the misogynist that your above comments portray you as.
    • Feb 01, 2010 20:20:47 Re: Apology to Rev. Otten - helen
      This is church, Mr. Brown?
      
      I haven't seen any other woman on here told to "Shut up."
      
      Pr. Petersen,
      I wrote first and investigated afterward. Mea culpa!
      I apologize to you for having done so and withdraw my comments..
      Helen
  • Jan 31, 2010 16:59:17 Re: Apology to Rev. Otten - helen
    OK, I read Otten as reproduced here (although it sounds much more like Cascione to me).
    
    I think you missed the humor of the piece! Putting "lcms liberals" and "hyper-Euros" in the same sentence and being serious about it cracked me up.
    
    I'm glad you studied the Brief Statement. Will those of us who couldn't come be able to hear/read your conclusions? (And why wouldn't you study it?) Will it next be verboten to study the Bible or the Book of Concord? I hope not because we are doing both.
• Jan 28, 2010 17:15:07 Re: Apology to Rev. Otten - Fran Szarejko
  I am in agreement with your assessment of Christian News and am humbled by your honesty. Too often I also allow anger to motivate my actions in defending our faith. This is a lesson to learn.
  
  Thanks and blessings.
• Jan 28, 2010 08:43:08 Re: Apology to Rev. Otten - Jeff
  Pr. Otten works for Voldemort?
  
  Huh... so much makes sense now...
• Jan 28, 2010 08:38:34 Re: Apology to Rev. Otten - Rev Neujahr
  That was a classy move, Pastor Peterson. You have my respect.

Otten Attacks Free Conference

• Jan 25, 2010 21:38:09 Re: Otten Attacks Free Conference - Pr. Martin Diers
  Pr. Peterson, your analysis is spot on.
  
  We once invited Jack Cascione to speak at one of the free conferences which we held in conjunction with the ACLC and ELDoNA. As to why he was invited? If nothing more so that we could hear him with our own ears, because, quite frankly, to hear him described by someone else, you would think it was more caricature than reality. Trust me. It's not.
  
  But I digress. At a round table discussion on what might divide our various bodies, Jack stated that he and ULMA would fellowship with a Jewish Synagogue if they would sign a Waltheresque constitution, because, after all, it is the constitution that establishes the orthodoxy of a congregation. Oh, and also the "divine supremacy of the voter's assembly" which is established by said constitution.
  
  He even went so far as to state, in no uncertain terms, that it was the constitution of the congregation that determined the validity of that congregation's Sacraments. If I hadn't heard this from his own mouth, I would not have believed it.
  
  Yes, this is how seriously Jack and Otten take paragraph 29 of the Brief Statement: "The orthodox character of a Church is established not by its mere name nor by its outward acceptance of, and subscription to, an orthodox creed, but by the doctrine which is actually taught in its pulpits..."
  • Jan 26, 2010 17:35:37 Re: Otten Attacks Free Conference - Brian Westgate
    For Jews to accept a Waltheresque constitution, wouldn't that mean rejecting Judaism in order to rightly confess the Evangelical-Lutheran Faith?
• Jan 19, 2010 07:31:28 Re: Otten Attacks Free Conference - Pr. John A. Frahm
  It appears that the choice for them is between higher critics and an a-historical perspective of an existential moment insight from bronze-age Missouri gurus giving us proper gnosis for that fast fleeting hour.
• Jan 18, 2010 07:13:34 Re: Otten Attacks Free Conference - Tom Fast
  I am really pleased to see you are going to take a look at the Brief Statement. We must try to determine how we got where we are in the LCMS. That means no stone ought to be left unturned and everything open for examination.
  
  I do hope you will make some of this available to the rest of us.
• Jan 17, 2010 23:06:23 Re: Otten Attacks Free Conference - Jojakim Dettmann
  We are discussing this blog post on LutherQuest. Feel free to join & comment, especially if you attended the Free Conference.
  
  http://www.lutherq...=229712#POST229712
  
  Thanks,
  
  Jojakim Dettmann
• Jan 16, 2010 15:57:07 Re: Otten Attacks Free Conference - Observer
  Unfortunately, you made the mistake many people make when Otten criticizes them. You responded. He loves this. This is precisely what he craves: attention.
  
  You should simply delete your post and ignore Herman Otten.
  
  He is a lunatic and you should not facilitate his insanity by even acknowledging that he exists.
• Jan 15, 2010 23:24:30 Re: Otten Attacks Free Conference - Iggy Antiochus
  Can someone tell me, does a person who is up for ordination have to also swear to things like the Brief Statement, Law and Gospel, Church and Ministry, etc.?
  
  These are not in our rite of ordination (or installation).
  
  At any rate, I am good with the vows as they are stated in our rite. If these other documents require a quia subscription, they should be added to the rite.
  
  PS: I can't make it to the free conference, or I would be happy to be the one to lead Messer's liturgical hip-hop. :)
• Jan 15, 2010 18:04:45 Re: Otten Attacks Free Conference - Fran Szarejko
  Otten often writes / speaks without his mind fully engaged.
• Jan 14, 2010 10:27:16 Re: Otten Attacks Free Conference - Paul Beisel
  Maybe you'll get better attendance now that Otten has advertised it in the newspaper. :)
• Jan 14, 2010 09:43:59 Re: Otten Attacks Free Conference - Rev. Fr. John W. Berg
  Forgive this trip down memory lane, but all this reminds me of what I wrote in our erstwhile confession "The Motley Magpie" back in July of 2005 (Vol. 3:3),
  
  "The hysteria recently shown by Pastor Jack Cascione on the pages of the Christian News in response to the reasoned and confessional arguments of Fr. David Petersen is a case in point. For rightly, ritely and not Romanly defining Ordination and for maintaining the Confessor’s view that the “laying on of hands” may be counted among the Sacraments, Father Dave has been tagged a “closest sacerdotalist” by smiling Jack. One can only wonder what the, I assume, mitered Petersen, reeking of incense, cradling a crosier in the crook of his surpliced arm does when vestibuled in his confessional closet."
  
  (And I still wonder!)
  
  Jack and Herman, two sad, pitiable men.
  
  Fondly
• Jan 14, 2010 07:31:48 Re: Otten Attacks Free Conference - Rev. Thomas C. Messer
  Excellent response, Pr. Petersen. It is Otten who makes an "a_ _" of himself with ridiculous articles such as this one. I have a suggestion for you when making your preliminary remarks and introductions. Have some funky music playing in the background, you know, something with a noticeable beat. Get someone else to stand up front and get the crowd to "put their hands together." When all have been moved by the music to clap along with the beat, have that person announce: "Petersen in da' House!" Then, when you come out, clapping along, of course, you say, "When I say Hyper, you say Euro (Hyper - Euro; Hyper - Euro); when I say Wilhelm, you say Loehe (Wilhelm - Loehe; Wilhelm - Loehe); when I say Anti, you say Walther (Anti - Walther; Anti - Walther); when I say Ordination, you say Sacrament (Ordination - Sacrament; Ordination - Sacrament." Optional: "When I say Voters' Supremacy, you say Not" (this is optional, since it would be a little awkward to stay on beat, but you could pull it off with a little practice). Make sure someone is recording this and send a copy to Herman and friends for their listening enjoyment. :)
  
  Seriously, wish I could make the conference. I'm sure it will be most excellent.

Also true of Theologians

• Jan 12, 2010 14:55:21 Re: Also true of Theologians - Anonymous
  reined in, man, reined in
  
  the rain falls mainly in the plain, the Queen reigns but not rules, reins control a horse, and are synonymous with kidneys, bleave it or not

Dr. Mark Kalthof added to Free Conference

• Jan 15, 2010 09:06:59 Re: Dr. Mark Kalthof added to Free Conference - Rev Jack A. Kozak
  Of course our confessions can withstand scrutiny and should be examined. But the tone of your post indicates you have already concluded the portion on the Papacy is bold and outdated. If that is the case, then why bother with a study?
  • Jan 16, 2010 14:31:06 Re: Dr. Mark Kalthof added to Free Conference - Brian Westgate
    I read that paragraph as saying that those in ELCA are claiming that the Brief Statement is off base on the papacy and the inspiration. Plus, it does kinda sound like a hook. He's grabbing our attention.
• Jan 12, 2010 14:54:58 Re: Dr. Mark Kalthof added to Free Conference - L P Cruz
  Will they be discussing: Statement 17,

  Quote:

  Scripture teaches that God hae
  already declared the whole world to be righteous in Christ, Rorn. 5,19;
  2 Cor. 5,18 5.; Rom. 4,25;

  • Jan 13, 2010 07:42:27 Re: Dr. Mark Kalthof added to Free Conference - Petersen
    I don't know what they will be discussing exactly. Much of it will be directed from the floor. My guess is that this is not a controversial point among American Lutherans and won't get much attention, but I could be wrong.
• Jan 12, 2010 09:01:52 Re: Dr. Mark Kalthof added to Free Conference - Pr. Lorfeld
  Will this be recorded? I was hoping to be able to attend, however due to my schedule I am unable to make it to the Symposium/Free Conference.
• Jan 11, 2010 12:47:23 Re: Dr. Mark Kalthof added to Free Conference - Rev. Jack A. Kozak
  The Brief Statement echos what our Confessions say of the Papacy. Are those portions of the Book of Concord 'bold and outdated?'
  • Jan 13, 2010 07:41:03 Re: Dr. Mark Kalthof added to Free Conference - Petersen
    Can the Confessions withstand scrutiny? Do we dare to compare them to the Holy Scriptures? Is our confession so weak and fearful that we must protect it against examination?
    
    Is this the Church of the Reformation or not?
    • Jan 13, 2010 12:32:08 Re: Dr. Mark Kalthof added to Free Conference - Rev. Charles Lehmann
      No. Yes. Yes.
      
      No.
      
      Er, um, nevermind. ;-)

The Octave of St. Stephen, Protomartyr

Octave of the Nativity,

The Circumcision of Our Lord and the Octave of the Nativity
January 1, 2010 A+D
St. Luke 2:21

In the Name of the Father and of the +Son and of the Holy Spirit. Amen.

Rejoice O Bethlehem, House of Bread, you are blessed. Receive her that is the City of God, the one in whom God dwells. Mary comes in...

The First Eggnog

Merry Christmas!
HT: Susan
...

• Dec 26, 2009 07:29:26 Re: The First Eggnog - Sweaver
  Gross.
  • Dec 31, 2009 21:29:52 Re: The First Eggnog - helen
    I can think of better things to do with eggs, milk, cinnamon and nutmeg... Mom's Christmas kuchen for one. :)
    
    (Anyone who wants it can have the rum.)

Coming Home for Christmas

• Dec 28, 2009 09:46:53 Re: Coming Home for Christmas - CarrieAnn
  Thanks for posting this so quickly. I missed most of "Christmas" this year with the flu, but was thinking that the day itself doesn't conjur up the same feelings of extreme joy as in the past. (don't get me wrong, I still enjoy and am delighted by the mercy He shows us on this day) This message reminds me of why, thank you.
• Dec 25, 2009 17:47:36 Re: Coming Home for Christmas - Heidi
  Thanks for posting this. I sure did miss Christmas at Redeemer this year, but God's grace abounds in His Son, Jesus. Merry Christmas Petersens!
• Dec 25, 2009 08:07:47 Re: Coming Home for Christmas - Beisel
  Wow. Excellent interpretation and proclamation.

The Creeping Dawn

• Dec 31, 2009 22:30:09 Re: The Creeping Dawn - helen
  We're gaining a few seconds daylight each week (and we're counting them even down in Texas).
  But "Down under" Christmas falls in summer, heading toward fall. So we can't make anything theological of it, can we?
• Dec 23, 2009 07:57:49 Re: The Creeping Dawn - Peter
  Greg, I'm with Petersen. It is cool. (Though I think it would be cooler if Christmas were in fact on the darkest day). And his thoughts build on the poetry of scripture, where Jesus is described as the Dayspring from on High, and finally becomes for us our everlasting Sun who overcomes the darkness of sin and death.
• Dec 22, 2009 14:28:36 Re: The Creeping Dawn - Greg M. Johnson
  One might be able to use human reasoning to rationalize why a festival is more cool or less cool. Could God work through a festival on shortest day, longest day, coldest day? Is it hopelessness to start celebrating before it gets warmer? Just recognize that your arguments are trying to put human icing on God's cake. We are but four-year-olds in the Master Chef's kitchen
• Dec 22, 2009 09:47:09 Re: The Creeping Dawn - Fr. Dustin L. Anderson
  Thank you for this article. It is frustrating to hear on TV false information about the celebration of our Lord's birth.
• Dec 22, 2009 07:42:59 Re: The Creeping Dawn - Sean
  He makes an interesting point that Christians don't much care if the origins are pagan or Christian, which ought to be a bit disconcerting. Especially for Christians that are against a higher-critical reading of the Scriptures, it's surprising to see that a higher-critical reading of the Church Year is permitted and welcomed. The result is usually the same: identifying underlying structures and forms or patterns of development that allow for parts to be altered, changed, or removed to better follow present day trends.
• Dec 22, 2009 07:36:10 Re: The Creeping Dawn - PAS
  Thanks for sharing this article. A gentleman mentioned the issue with me yesterday, regarding the "pagan" roots of Christmas and why Christmas therefore is a false holiday. I explained that this was not true, but with much less accuracy than this article.
  
  I'll direct him to the information.